I think that they have bailed out enough. I don’t think that this should be anybody’s problem. People can’t buy cars with no jobs no money. Who will it be next that want to bail out. It just gets worse. Bail out the American People. What about there car payments, truck payments. Bail them out. Then maybe we can go out and have a Big Party like the AIG did.

I think your viewpoint is restricted to what you see immediately in front of you.  If it weren’t for “bail outs” (aka Government Subsidies), many (if not most ) farms would be out of business, nuclear power would not be possible, rail / train service would have ceased to exist, etc.  Did you know that our government pays out over $16 billion a year to farmers to keep their farms in operation?  If it weren’t for these subsidies, then one single year of bad weather would shut down thousands of farms because they would not have any crop at all to sell to pay the bills.

There’s a whole lot more to stake, like millions of people dying of starvation, or unemployment rates like during the depression, than people being able to make a car payment (on a vehicle that might well have been beyond their means to buy in the first place).

Did you know that they are spending a billion dollars a day on the war. It makes a whole lot of since to me that this money could help farmers,people dying of starvation. I could care less about a car payment. My point is the money they have already put out for all of these bail outs are not working. Maybe you could help the goverment out with some of your thoughts. It’s like throwing money out the window. But when these taxes go up. I want to see what people have to say then. Who is going to pay all of this bail out money that has been handed out. Who is going to pay. WE ARE!

Is this 16 billion paid to keep farms in operation or out of operation?

Exactly!!  I don’t mind farm subsidies that stabilize the farmers…it’s the ones that pay the landowners (not farmers) to keep their land out of production.  The biggest businessmen (and congressmen) know best how to use those “subsidies” to collect an extra paycheck on land they never had intentions of farming.

If you work at TRW or DANA or many other places like that you would want this bail out

drover - 10 November 2008 11:39 AM

Is this 16 billion paid to keep farms in operation or out of operation?

Do you have a green thumb?  Have you ever pared down a plant, or tree, or shrub, so that the less healthy branches are not consuming nourishment that could be dedicated to more productive parts of the plant?

Our country is not communist - fortunately our government cannot simply shut down a farm or business out of the blue.  So providing some degree of recompense for some farms to produce less, so that the market values of crops will not hit the floor, or so that less land is being farmed during drought or other hardships preventing a recurrence of the dust-bowl, is simply wise.

That is straight out of the free market manual isn’t it?

There’s such a thing?  I was just typing out a bit of common sense.

I thought you claimed to be a conservative but yet you want to pay people not to work.  I don’t get it unless this just applies to the farmers who own so much land they just don’t want to be bothered with trying to plant all of it.  I’ll bet Ted Turner has a few acres he would just as soon not plant next year.

drover - 11 November 2008 08:51 PM

I thought you claimed to be a conservative but yet you want to pay people not to work.

Sorry, but I’m not one of those people that says “Now what type of opinion is a good conservative supposed to have in this matter, so I can adjust my thought process accordingly.“

You’re also grossly oversimplifying the issue to say that the government is paying people not to work.  Farmers have plenty else to do, and usually have diversification into other types of crops or livestock or extra jobs just to make ends meet.

Not worth it.  bye

This “bail out” plan is outright socialism, and it runs completely counter to the spirit of a free market economy. But, now that the Democrats are in control, more and more socialist plans are on the horizon. The market should be allowed to go through a process of evolution on its own: let the weaker companies die, and allow the strongest to survive. The government has no business interfering in this case, regardless of how many jobs will be lost when companies like GM crumble. Taxpayers would be forced to pay for the bad business decisions of companies like GM. Government subsidies should not be rewarded for poor business practices. These companies should be left to fend for themselves in the free market, rather than our tax dollars paying for their inefficiencies.

CBS News Big Three Bailout? Not So Fast

One of the best reasons why Detroit automakers should not receive a bailout can be found in a General Motors “Jobs Bank” program that, bizarrely, pays employees not to work.

A beneficiary of that program was someone named Jerry Mellon, who worked for GM until his division merged with another in 2000 and he was no longer needed. Except for a brief period in 2001, Mellon received his full salary for not working, which reached $64,500 a year by 2006. Include benefits, and the annual cost to GM exceeds $100,000.

To earn his pay, Mellon was given the formidable task of showing up in a windowless shed, sitting at a table, and doing nothing for eight hours a day for six years, according to a profile in the Wall Street Journal. Jobs Bank employees have the option of attending classes teaching such important manufacturing skills as dealing blackjack and poker. Mellon spent part of his time reading Reader’s Digest, learning how to play Trivial Pursuit, napping on a makeshift bed of chairs pushed together, or simply staring at the wall for hours at a time.

Dan, I agree with you 100% on this one. The farmers should be getting more money. I don’t know or can not count the dairy farms that have went out of Business just in the Glade Spring Area. The price of milk is twice the cost of gas now. I can’t see where the price of food has come down at all, but I’m sure that will come in time. I’m just going to not watch the news anymore because maybe I’m just not smart enough to know whats really going on. But I have sure learned alot from you guys.

Nothing is black and white, so as with everything, the bail-out packages help in some ways, and are harmful in others.  Drover was talking about how the farm subsidies are abused, and investors buy farms knowing that they will receive money for not operating them.  I’m sure stuff like that occurs, and it would be good if the legislation could be tightened up to prevent that kind of abuse.  However it certainly is beneficial, and is necessary to alleviate the ups and downs of a business whose profitability is determined by something as fleeting as the weather.  We go to William’s Orchard every year in the fall to get pumpkins, etc (usually on school or preschool field trips).  Last year it was somewhat pitiful.  The frost that hit in the spring killed all the apple blossoms, so they had no apples.  So they literally had to buy apples from other areas and bring them in.  I don’t know if they received government assistance, but that is exactly the type of thing the subsidies are designed to smooth over.

I posted the story about the GM workers being paid to do nothing as an opposing view to the bail out plan.  Our auto makers need to be lean and mean to compete against the likes of the Japanese.  That’s going to mean sacrifice, and not every last employee at the Big 3 will be able to go along for the ride.  My grandfather retired from Ford, and he feels strongly about unions and always looking out for the employees, so this hits close to home.  I can see why Bush is really dragging his feet about throwing money at the automakers, even though Obama has already visited him practically begging Bush to institute the bailout now (instead of waiting until he is in office in two months).  The problem lies much deeper than this temporary downturn in the economy.